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War in Ukraine

Heh, Canada would do better than us against the US, if only because it doesn't have to face the USN as step 1.
I dunno about that, Canada is tiny as opposed to France, they're like about HALF the size of France and France has a pretty scary military, if not a large one.
Also: isn't like 90% of the Canadian population bunched up against the US-Canadian border?
 
I dunno about that, Canada is tiny as opposed to France, they're like about HALF the size of France and France has a pretty scary military, if not a large one.
Also: isn't like 90% of the Canadian population bunched up against the US-Canadian border?
Still better odds than, you know, having to cross the Atlantic against a hostile USN. Also, according to archive footage of operation Canadian Bacon, the Canucks win it easy.
 
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It was too tempting, I couldn't resist! :p
 
Posturing and PR.
Athis point I'm wondering why the UN even exists in the first place, it's been moderately good at maintaining an unusually long period of peace, but beyond that?
 
Athis point I'm wondering why the UN even exists in the first place, it's been moderately good at maintaining an unusually long period of peace, but beyond that?
Because the role of the UN is not enforcement, it's to be a diplomatic forum for everyone as well as a framework for common activities such as protection of culture, global health, etc. The small details called 'nuclear weapons' and 'globalised economy' means that there are countries which you literally CANNOT impose things on at the scale of the UN because they can and will flip the table. If you do not acknowledge this reality in the structure of your international organisation, then it ends like the Society of Nations: the big players simply refuse its rulings and there's nothing anyone can do about it.

The UN works precisely *because* it remains aware of its limits.
 
Because the role of the UN is not enforcement, it's to be a diplomatic forum for everyone as well as a framework for common activities such as protection of culture, global health, etc. The small details called 'nuclear weapons' and 'globalised economy' means that there are countries which you literally CANNOT impose things on at the scale of the UN because they can and will flip the table. If you do not acknowledge this reality in the structure of your international organisation, then it ends like the Society of Nations: the big players simply refuse its rulings and there's nothing anyone can do about it.

The UN works precisely *because* it remains aware of its limits.
Ah okay, that makes sense. Would be nice to have some kind of a check smaller nations could use against the larger ones when they act out as Russia is doing in Ukraine or the U.S. is doing propping up a rogue theocracy currently engaged in ethnic cleansing *Sigh*
 
Ah okay, that makes sense. Would be nice to have some kind of a check smaller nations could use against the larger ones when they act out as Russia is doing in Ukraine or the U.S. is doing propping up a rogue theocracy currently engaged in ethnic cleansing *Sigh*
There is such a check: it's called 'nuclear weapons'.
 
There is such a check: it's called 'nuclear weapons'.
Maybe the triumvirate of France, the US and UK can be ballsier I guess? It would really help if Biden lifted the restrictions on Ukraine's ability to use long range weapons.
 
Maybe the triumvirate of France, the US and UK can be ballsier I guess? It would really help if Biden lifted the restrictions on Ukraine's ability to use long range weapons.
EU and US are the main backers, yes, with the whole thing being escalation management from all sides. It's possible that South Korea will enter the fray and start delivering shells by the litteral boatload as well. Still, what matters for Ukraine's backers is that the Russian stockpiles and population are both getting mauled adequately.
 
The UN is basically there to give us a forum to organize shit like Smallpox Eradication, which I still consider the biggest triumph the UN/WHO has ever had.
 
The UN is basically there to give us a forum to organize shit like Smallpox Eradication, which I still consider the biggest triumph the UN/WHO has ever had.
That's something that never gets talked about here in the US due to the overwhelming deluge of nationalism bias in media and education
 
Point is, the UN was not devised as a tool to legitimate a US global hegemony, else noone would have accepted it outside UK.
Pretty sure Russia being an imperialist asshole is a problem for everyone, not just the US
 
Pretty sure Russia being an imperialist asshole is a problem for everyone, not just the US
Not really. It is a problem for the weak neighbours who are not already clients or suzerains of Russia. The rest do not care much for it, Russia is not capable of doing too much harm far from its borders except in places where it works in collaboration with the local autocrats to improve the looting of national resources. And as for the neighbours themselves? They're NATO, oligarch-controlled, Russian vassals or China.

Just like the Israel-Palestine situation, Russia is Someone Else's Problem if you aren't NATO.
 
Not really. It is a problem for the weak neighbours who are not already clients or suzerains of Russia. The rest do not care much for it, Russia is not capable of doing too much harm far from its borders except in places where it works in collaboration with the local autocrats to improve the looting of national resources. And as for the neighbours themselves? They're NATO, oligarch-controlled, Russian vassals or China.

Just like the Israel-Palestine situation, Russia is Someone Else's Problem if you aren't NATO.
Well considering the fact Russia has nukes and chemical weapons and those can reach just about anywhere I wouldn't be too comfortable if you're in NATO Europe. Russia may be weak militarily but they're technologically pretty strong, just look at the rash of political assassinations across Europe recently against dissidents using poisoning techniques...
 
Well considering the fact Russia has nukes and chemical weapons and those can reach just about anywhere I wouldn't be too comfortable if you're in NATO Europe. Russia may be weak militarily but they're technologically pretty strong, just look at the rash of political assassinations across Europe recently against dissidents using poisoning techniques...
Yes, and DPRK can send nukes pretty much anywhere too. And Pakistan, etc. The situation doesn't change: noone outside immediate neighbours and their allies cares about Russia's happy fun time.
 
I support Ukraine against Russia. NATO on the other hand I'm a bit more suspicious of
Eh.

NATO as an alliance does what alliances does. It's just that this declaration does nothing to help Ukraine.


  1. We urge all countries not to provide any kind of assistance to Russia's aggression. We condemn all those who are facilitating and thereby prolonging Russia's war in Ukraine.
  2. Belarus continues to enable this war by making available its territory and infrastructure. Russia's deepening political and military integration of Belarus, including the deployment of advanced Russian military capabilities and personnel, has negative implications for regional stability and the defence of the Alliance.
  3. The Democratic People's Republic of Korea (DPRK) and Iran are fuelling Russia's war of aggression against Ukraine by providing direct military support to Russia, such as munitions and uncrewed aerial vehicles (UAVs), which seriously impacts Euro-Atlantic security and undermines the global non-proliferation regime. We strongly condemn the DPRK's exports of artillery shells and ballistic missiles, which are in violation of numerous United Nations Security Council resolutions, and note with great concern the deepening ties between the DPRK and Russia. Any transfer of ballistic missiles and related technology by Iran to Russia would represent a substantial escalation.
  4. The PRC has become a decisive enabler of Russia's war against Ukraine through its so-called "no limits" partnership and its large-scale support for Russia's defence industrial base. This increases the threat Russia poses to its neighbours and to Euro-Atlantic security. We call on the PRC, as a permanent member of the United Nations Security Council with a particular responsibility to uphold the purposes and principles of the UN Charter, to cease all material and political support to Russia's war effort. This includes the transfer of dual-use materials, such as weapons components, equipment, and raw materials that serve as inputs for Russia's defence sector. The PRC cannot enable the largest war in Europe in recent history without this negatively impacting its interests and reputation.
  5. The PRC continues to pose systemic challenges to Euro-Atlantic security. We have seen sustained malicious cyber and hybrid activities, including disinformation, stemming from the PRC. We call on the PRC to uphold its commitment to act responsibly in cyberspace. We are concerned by developments in the PRC's space capabilities and activities. We call on the PRC to support international efforts to promote responsible space behaviour. The PRC continues to rapidly expand and diversify its nuclear arsenal with more warheads and a larger number of sophisticated delivery systems. We urge the PRC to engage in strategic risk reduction discussions and promote stability through transparency. We remain open to constructive engagement with the PRC, including to build reciprocal transparency with the view of safeguarding the Alliance's security interests. At the same time, we are boosting our shared awareness, enhancing our resilience and preparedness, and protecting against the PRC's coercive tactics and efforts to divide the Alliance.

The materials in question were not under the sanctions list, being raw materials or potential dual use components such as optics and drone components.

It's essentially serving as a notice for China to not sell stuff to Russia and leave her strategic partner up shit creek, while promising that China is on the shit list by questioning the PRC attempts to modernise her nuclear arsenal and acquire space capabilities.

It's inherently hostile and polarising, which may well harden approaches in China, escalating to say arms sales to Russia. It's just not ..good politically and doesn't help Ukraine.


Hell, Biden claims that the Chinese are selling machine tools to Russia, which help maintain Russian tank industries and etc. but the majority of the CNC imports, which were banned this year came from Taiwan.

 
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Eh.

NATO as an alliance does what alliances does. It's just that this declaration does nothing to help Ukraine.




The materials in question were not under the sanctions list, being raw materials or potential dual use components such as optics and drone components.

It's essentially serving as a notice for China to not sell stuff to Russia and leave her strategic partner up shit creek, while promising that China is on the shit list by questioning the PRC attempts to modernise her nuclear arsenal and acquire space capabilities.

It's inherently hostile and polarising, which may well harden approaches in China, escalating to say arms sales to Russia. It's just not ..good politically and doesn't help Ukraine.


Hell, Biden claims that the Chinese are selling machine tools to Russia, which help maintain Russian tank industries and etc. but the majority of the CNC imports, which were banned this year came from Taiwan.

Makes my inner conspiracy theorist wonder if China and NATO are playing good cop bad cop vis a vis Russia
 
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